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of charges that becomes a big foreign policy problem. that's one of the reasons why the state department was so opposed to the waterboarding under colin powell. >> exactly. to have it labeled -- so then you get into the territory of were crimes committed? and what kind of future implications there are for that. >> briefly, before i let you go. we do want to talk about it in more detail, the book. the appreciate now to move the program from the cia back to where many say it afc belonged in the military where there could be more oversight. what you've uncovered is the extent of secret relationships with pakistan, things that have never been reported, never been revealed, i guess, to other than the intel gens community? >> i think when you look at the history of the secret war since 9/11, there's so much that's gone on in the shadows that we have not known about and not certainly told to the public or told to congress. as you said, pressure is building to become more transparent. president obama set in the state of the union there would be more transparency, and we'll see what happens. >> t
and we could concentrate solely on traditional foreign policy threats like iran and syria and the instability of the korean peninsula. of course those threats remain large but this shows we are still a country in terrorist cross hairs both from abroad and from within. >> it sounds like you think this will reshape our focus as well. >> i think it will, no question about that. but at the same time we've got to make sure that we don't single out one particular community for attack and os t tracism. >> it's very common for them to sfwring we don't care at all to we exaggerate the threat. this is a common pendulum swing. it's also a mistake. and what we've also seen, just in the last week, is most of the coverage and most of the discussion by elites on both side of the aisle has been far more measured than what you just read by representative king. >> but it was measured because we were still a country in crisis. now that it seems that the crisis, perhaps, has subsided, now the nuts will come out. >> that's true, and this is where the media plays an even bigger role. in the mon
think about in modern history any time there's been an attack by an immigrant or foreign born national in this country, it directly affected immigration policy. in 1993, the bombing led to the 1996 immigration overhaul which kicked a lot of immigrants off welfare and tightened up a lot of things there. after 9/11 there was a lot of different culture about immigration changing entirely. we had books defendi ining internme internment. even tknow there's no connectio, it will affect things. >> let's play sound from senator dick durbin. a member of the gang of eight. >> the worst thing we can do is nothing. if we do nothing leaving 11 million people in the shadows not making borders safer, not having information that comes from employment and these visa holders, we will be less safe in america. immigration reform will make us safer. >> victoria, what's your take on this? what's this going to mean for immigration reform? >> it absolutely will make us safer. we'll see millions more dollars going into border enforcement. one of the key provisions is we'll have an effective visa entry and exit
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